PDA

View Full Version : Ultra Lead ????



zoean
07-08-2005, 07:55 AM
Got some questions on my UL, and I hope someone could help me out :)

1.) Flubby/Bassy low end.(The amp is just un-usable on my marshall 4x12 GT75's, 16ohm) Better on my Mesa 2x12 w/ v30's.
2.) Low overall volume (have to push the master around 3:00 to compete with band? Channel volumes set at 1:00-2:00)
3.) They have the original tubes in it... Will changinging tubes help?

I can't seem to find any troubleshooting info, so your help is greatly appreciated! I've played one before, and something seems just a bit off??? Thanks -Jeff

lenni
07-08-2005, 11:31 AM
That definately sounds like dying power tubes. Tubes just wear out with playing hours. I recently put new ones in my 50st and it made a huge difference. Be sure to pick good ones, it feels like VHTs start to breathe with the right pt's.

Giga
07-09-2005, 04:25 AM
Have you checked if your FX-loop is engaged and if so, if your levels are set correct ?


Giga.

SteveVHT
07-09-2005, 04:42 AM
And that cabinet and speakers will never sound tight. That is more than likely the majority of the flubby bass.
Steve

zoean
07-09-2005, 10:37 AM
Have you checked if your FX-loop is engaged and if so, if your levels are set correct ?


Giga.
Yeah, I bypassed the FX loop completly. So that's not it. I'm going to drop in new Power Tubes, and see if that's resolves things.

As for the speak/Cab combo... I think you r right SteveLINY. I've never played an amp so fickle to speakers in my life.

If anyone hears of a loose VHT, drop me a line :)

Thanks for the help guys! -Peace

XPoopX
07-23-2005, 09:02 PM
I have the same cabinet. Would Vintage 30's take care of the problem? Or is it a matter of the actual cabinet?


And that cabinet and speakers will never sound tight. That is more than likely the majority of the flubby bass.
Steve

zoean
07-23-2005, 09:59 PM
What speakers do you think would be the "tightest" replacement?

J.B.
07-24-2005, 01:28 PM
What speakers do you think would be the "tightest" replacement?Eminence P-50's that come stock in VHT cabs. They make a huge difference with the UL.

Joe
07-24-2005, 03:46 PM
Well, always need to make sure the amp has matched and biased tubes that are not going dead, but even if you do...

>1.) Flubby/Bassy low end.(The amp is just un-usable on my marshall 4x12 GT75's, 16ohm) Better on my Mesa 2x12 w/ v30's.

Well it gets better with a different cab, so I am ruling out the amp for a minute. Those G12T whatever they are speakers are ok. Not winning many awards, but but they are not terrible for handling bass either. The biggest issue is the cab. The VHT P50 speakers have a lot of doping and they are very tight, but it's like tits on a bull if you put them in the Marshall expecting a huge difference.

Tight sounding cabs are built to sound tight. It's a trade off. Even VHT had to build a different cab for the Deliverance so it would match the amp better. The typical Marshall sound is looser, it is not air tight, and you have the cab vibrating more. Cabs that are rigid and tight are usually sealed back and tuned for that sound. I think your practical choices are to get a new cab, or to try to make the one you have work. For a new cab, I would go VHT because it's the only one I know of that is sealed back and really tuned for tight low end. I would not go try other speakers in the Marshall cab without tuning the cab first!

You can cheaply tune the Marshall. This won't turn it into a sealed back front loaded cab with 4 glued-in posts, but it will help a lot. Black Sabbath's old tech taught me this, but it's nothing high tech or new. I have done this to a couple of boutique Marshall repro cabs and it works quite well. First you need to cut standing waves. They are the enemy. Get that egg-crate patterned foam:

http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=260-516

Line the inside of your cab with it. The rule of thumb is two contiguous sides, but I would do all sides (top and bottom). Don't line the back panel.

To prevent the "back panel rattle" (this is assuming there is a post attached to the baffle that is "supposed" to brace against the back panel). Usually, when the baffle moves when you play, air gets between the post and the back panel and it makes you sound flabby. That can be super obvious if there is a lot of space between the post and the back panel, but it can also not be loud enough for you to think it's the post rattling, but you will just think to yourself "I sound like crap". I lay the cab face down, take a piece of cardboard from a used up packing tape roll (about 4" of it) and lay it over the post end so it curves right over the end towards the baffle. Then I screw the back on. The back panel will arch ever so slightly, but that's ok. You want this to be tight. You can use a shim or something a little more flexible like a piece of rubber too.

I would not do this, but you can also use weather stripping to seal the cab up around the back panel perimeter, but that gets tricky, so don't bother.

You don't have to do this, but I would replace the angel hair pasta speaker wire with at least 16 gauge oxygen free speaker wire. I use 12 myself. I would use a good, short, oxygen free speaker cable from the amp to the cab too.

If that tightens up the cab well enough for you, great. If you still are not happy, I really think it's not worth spending money on speakers (tits on a bull). IF you start thinking about other speakers, I would not try any other Celestion other than the CL80. V30's have a LOT of cone movement. They are not that tight. I know Mesa puts them in their cabs, but Mesa's best seller was/is an amp with THREE freaking rectifiers. Talk about loose sounding. They are not good examples for really tight tones. The CL80 has a heavy magnet which improves punch (the G12T is medium weight I think. I think the V30 is medium as well. The P50 is medium as well, but it's the doping that keeps that thing tight for the most part). You can try EV style speakers like Weber Michigans, but they do not have much break up and they have large voice voils, so while they have great bass and punch, the lead tones are lacking. At that point, you are spending money and it's better to sell the cab and get something better.

<2.) Low overall volume (have to push the master around 3:00 to compete with band? Channel volumes set at 1:00-2:00)

channel volumes are too low.

Also, it's easy to dial out the mids on a UL...but if you do it too much the human ear has a low sound level perception to just bass and highs. Just a thought.

Hope that helps.

zoean
07-24-2005, 04:36 PM
Well, always need to make sure the amp has matched and biased tubes that are not going dead, but even if you do...


Hey Joe- It's posts like this that makes these forums a valuble source of information!
Thanks for taking the time. -Jeff

XPoopX
07-25-2005, 10:14 AM
How many pieces would it take to do all four sides of a standard Marshall cab? Would you recommend glue or staples (maybe even both)?

Joe
07-25-2005, 11:30 PM
Well I bought a butt load cause I did 8 cabs at once. Just measure the top, bottom, and sides and do the math. I used 3m adhesive and a staple gun. You have to get the glue real tacky before stapling. I use staples at the corners and here and there. I do not trust the glue 100% for some reason.